subwoofers

[i3eal2sfan]

does anyone have the center subwoofer councle thing that holds a 6 1/2 sub? im thinken about getting that or a 10 in the trunk behind the back seat but thinken that the 6 1/2 wont sound very good. any help is appreciated. thanks.

[Jeepskate]

I'd go for the 10" behind the back seat (firing down). I've never heard the console setup, but wouldn't expect much from a 6.5" driver in a plastic box...certainly not going to rival the performance of a 10".

[i3eal2sfan]

the only thing is that im worried about it getting stolen since i dont have a hard top and in the summer ill wanna take the top off. is there anything i can do to keep it form getting stolen?

[BigBadYJ]

I have a box I made behind the seat with two 10s. I bolted the amp to it and made it so you cant see the amp. I hurced the box and bolted it thru the floor with carraige bolts so you cant take the bolt off without takin the subs out and inbolting from the inside. I have had mine in my Jeep for three years and am now in college parked on the street everyday and have never had mine messed with or stolen. The box looks more like a toolbox than a sub box since its hurced.

[i3eal2sfan]

wuts hurced mean?

[Hoosier Daddy]

http://www.dougiesbuggybath.com/images/herc_hdr2.jpg

[i3eal2sfan]

:confused: huh? lol

[MedRedRaider]

I drive a 97 Wrangler and I have recently put a 10" JBL GTi down-fired in the back behind the rear seat with a 1200 watt JBL amp under the seat. It barely fit, but fit nonetheless. I really don't think I could have fit a larger sub into that space, because a 12" requires too much air space. I tried using a sealed box, but the acoustics of the Wrangler vehicle just don't make it sound very good, so I was forced to get a ported box that takes up all the room in the back (which I ended up bedlining the box so it is water resistant and scratch-proof). As for security, the box itself is bolted down in such a way that you cannot remove the bolts unless the rear tailgate is open (which I always keep locked). The amps for my speakers and sub are underneath the rear seat, protected from any water my Jeep comes across. The amps cannot be accessed unless the seat is removed, and it is a fold-and-tumble style seat, so it can't be folded down with the box in the back. Nobody can even tell that I have a sub in the summer, when I keep my soft top resting on the back covering the box. I would strongly recommend a 10 or 12 inch sub in the rear area (down-fired if it is too thick) instead of the 6 inch console. Though the console is kinda cool, it wont provide the proper range a sub should nor would it give you the effects of a subwoofer (i.e., shaking stuff, air movement, "feeling it"). Plus, if it blew, how would you replace it? Nobody makes a 6 inch sub (the only one I can think of is RF). Get a GTi... it is sweet, and has the best sound quality I've ever heard.

[Imrubicon]

I have tyhe center console sub and it is a big improvement over not having t but it is not a ghetto thumper by any means most teens will laugh at you but it does round out the jeeps lack of bass a little bit .I have heard a 8 inch someone put in the center console and bigger is better .as for the twin 10's in the rear someone will know they are their as you will want to play them someday maybe??? I like the center console idea and may go with a tuffy which should take a 8 and maybe a ten with a decent amp under the seat to push it .out of sight means they might not try in the first place .I still use the factoray grills in the sound pods as I want it to look like nothing to steal JMHO

[i3eal2sfan]

aight thanks alot guys heres wut im getten tell me if this is all i need or if it is good or not:


2 Rockford Fosgate HE2 10" Subs
1600 Watt 2 Channel Pyramid Amp
Rockford 4 Gauge 6 Amp Kit w/ 1 Farad Capacitor
Custom Wrangler Box


let me know if this would be a good set up or if i should get more/less or if i have everything here i need to set it up. and if anyone knows any good deals for anything let me know. thanks alot smile.gif

[hockeymutt]

hey i read your old post...but it got locked....goto ebay.....and look for an audiobahn 10.....i was going to buy one wheni looked in the best buy sales paper and found 2 10's wiht a 460 watt amp for 120 and couldn't pass it up....the audiobahn will run you 50...plus liek 20 shipping it has an 400 watt rms 1000 peak and 120 oz double stacked magnet....the product number is liek 1000qw...hope that helps

[i3eal2sfan]

thanks man. but will that sound like crap? or is it pretty good?

[hockeymutt]

i have no idea but it's audiobahn one of the best sound companies on the market....so it probally will sound good...i was at an expo last weekend ad i saw one up close and wish i would have bought one.....but they were tryign to sell last years model liek it was a brand new model for 2004...i'm in the same boat as you just got my car and just trying to load my rig up...

[i3eal2sfan]

the amp is whats screwin me. i have no idea what to look for in an amp. to power 2 10" subs do i need a mono? 2 channel? and lets say the subs r 600w max and like 200 rms a piece. does that mean if i get a mono amp then it has to be able to crank out 400 rms? can someone please help me with amps and recommend a nice solid amp for kinda cheap that will be enough to power 2.... lets say 10" rockford fosgate punchs.
thanks

[ChrisYJ]

For an amp, stay with a reputable name like RF, MTX, Kicker, Sony, JBL, etc. If you go with the cheap ones, chances are it will crap out in no time, or shutdown due to overheating. I bought a cheap amp for my first setup, and after about 15-20 minutes of normal playing it would turn off because of heat, then back on 5 minutes later, then off again, .... Since your looking at Sound Domains site, they have a Fosgate amp, the Punch 301M that says it will do 300 rms @ 2ohms. Most likely it will do between 350-400 watts rms, the birth certificate will tell you exactly. Not sure about Fosgate, but alot of companies also rate their amps at 12.5 volts, not normal operating amps your vehicle will produce, so...if you need 400 watts for two RF 10s, then that amp should be perfect for it.

[i3eal2sfan]

ok so is this right........ if u have 2 subs that each have 200 rms at 4 ohms.... then do u need an amp that can pump out 400 rms at 4 ohms or 200 rms at 4 ohms? ok so an amp with 200 rms at 4 ohms, with 2 subs, does it pump 200 to each sub or only 100 to each sub then. sry for bein so confusing but im confused as hell. and what about subs with 8 ohms? amps dont even show rms for 8 ohms :confused:

[ChrisYJ]

That amp will do 350-400 at 2ohms. If the subs are 4ohms, then you need to parallel them so they will give the amp a 2 ohm load. That sub amp should only have one + and -. So, if each sub has its' own terminal on the box, and each sub is showing a 4ohm load, then take your speaker wire from each terminal and secure them BOTH to the single + and - on the amp. This will put the subs in parallel droping the impedance to 2ohms, which is what you want.

[corndogggy]

Also remember that anytime you bridge an amp, it actually "sees" half of the resistance. For example, if you take two 4 ohm subs and run them in parallel, your nominal resistance will be 2 ohms. If you took that setup and plugged it into, say, the right or left output of your amp, your amp would see 2 ohms for that side. However, if you bridged the amp, it will see 1 ohm. I'm pretty sure that amp manufacturers take this into account anymore since they rate the amps at a 2 ohm load while bridged mono. To make it even more confusing, amps rarely see the given nominal load while playing real music. It's not uncommon for a 4 ohm sub to give 40 ohms resistance at a given frequency. It's not really something you have to consider for your setup, but interesting nonetheless.

For your setup, and your budget, why not consider what I'm going to do soon - a single Infinity Perfect 12" sub, and a smaller Rockford amp. You could do that for about $300, and your cabinet only has to be like 1 cubic foot. Fosgate amps kick ass. I used to hit 137 db with two cheap Series 1 12's sitting in a bandpass isobarik box, which is extremely inefficient, and only had a Punch 40 powering them. My car was in the May '96 (I think) edition of Auto Sound and Security magazine.

[corndogggy]

Originally posted by i3eal2sfan:
if u have 2 subs that each have 200 rms at 4 ohms.... I think you're just looking at it wrong. First, figure out what kind of subs you want. Don't consider resistance at this point. Then, pick out an amp that is closely matched to what the subs can handle. Based on the resistance that your amp can handle, you want to buy subs that have a resistance that you can wire up in a certain combination so your amp sees a load that it can handle.

If you wire subs in parallel, the resistance drops in half. Wire them in series, and it doubles. Bridging the amp drops the load that the amp sees in half, but as mentioned in the previous post, I'm not sure how manufacturers are rating them. Back in the day, you normally only wanted to get down to a 4 ohm nominal load, because your amp would see 2 ohms if bridged. Now they are rating them as being bridged into two ohms, so I'm not sure if it's the same setup, or they really can be bridged to 2 ohms and see 1 ohm.

So yeah, one way or another, if you have two subs that can handle 200 watts rms each, you can get an amp that can pump out 400 watts rms at the load that you make based on however you wire the two subs up.

[i3eal2sfan]

ok. i have no idea what any of u said about the amps :confused: and i have no idea what subs or amps r good and no idea what any of the frequency and crossover stuff is and all of that. i only under stand the rms and peak watts a little bit. can someone recommend something for me? i have a soft top and only have $300 to spend. what subs/amp would u recommend to keep me at or a little above $300. it doesnt have to be the best subs in the world, i just wanna hear them with the top on and hopefully when the tops off also. sry for bein such a dumbass :rolleyes: thanks

[corndogggy]

Here's what I'm getting, would be a great setup for you. Less than $300. That doesn't count wires, shipping, and box though.

Infinity Perfect 12:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3067342422&category=48614

Rockford punch 501S:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3067156980&category=18796

Holy cow that would sound good. smile.gif Nice and simple too.

[i3eal2sfan]

wouldnt 2 tens sound better tho and would i be able to hear 1 12 when the top is off?

[corndogggy]

With that kind of power, I think you'll be able to hear it plenty. Plus look at the efficiency. 96 dB with one watt at one foot. That's crazy to be that efficient and still be able to suck up all that power. You gain 3 dB every time you double your amplifier power. You gain 6 dB by doubling the amount of drivers, but 10's will be less efficient too. One 12" would save space too. Last time I checked, Jeeps didn't exactly have the room of a Cadillac's trunk behind the seat. Alot of people wouldn't agree, but I'd take one high quality 12" over two mediocre 10's any day.

[Jeep_X03]

I dont know much bout subwoffers either but i was at a sound place and they said that 2 10's would sound better then 1 12, even tho the 10's might be a littel bit worse then the 1 12 since u have 2 off them it would be easier to hear them with the top off

[i3eal2sfan]

so should i get 2 10's or 1 12 :confused:

[corndogggy]

Ok say you were considering two MTX Thunder4000 T4104A 10" subs instead of that Infinity I showed you. First of all, your box will be bigger. Second of all, you're looking at only a 39 Hz frequency response instead of 19 Hz from the Infinity. That's an entire octave! Your sensitivity for one sub is only 87.7 dB as compared to 96 for the Infinity. Even if you fed those 10's twice as much power as the Infinity, by using the approximate 6 dB gain rule for doubling the surface area, you're still only at 93.7 dB instead of the 96 dB that you could have had from the Infinity with half the power. Then look at the power range - the Infinity will accept 500 watts rms while the two MTX's will only take 200 each, or 400 total. Yeah there's too many variables, but I just took the first mediocre 10" sub I could find on Crutchfield to compare. If I were looking at a choice between these two, I think it's obvious what I would take. Screw what the shop says. ;)

[i3eal2sfan]

ok well since im a dumbass, and know nothing about subs..... i have no idea what u just said :rolleyes: so are u sayen i should go with the 1 12 infinity then? and can that fit behind the back seat? and what box would i need for that? once again, sry for so many questioins and for bein such a dumbass. thanks

[corndogggy]

Ok I basically said that the one Infinity 12" would be louder with less input power, will go twice as low, will accept 25% more power, and have 2/3 the box space as those two 10's.

[b1pig]

I'm not gonna come in here and make waves. Or am I? :D


I would keep this as simple as possible for any person who is new and learning. Dude. You want a good reliable setup?

Go to a stereo shop. Listen to a single 12 compared to a pair of 10s. Then. Once you have narrowed it down to which ones you like, ask the person what the airspace requrement is. Many 10s will work fine down to .75 cubic foot of airspace (each), but you will find that if you go towards the upper edge of the recommended airspace, then the sub(s) will tend to perform much better.

If you get two 10s, buy two 4ohm subs. If the subs work at 200w RMS, buy a 2 channel amp that is 200w RMS per channel. Wire each sub to its own channel. Why? Even if you have purchased an amp that is stable at 2ohms, the amp will produce MUCH more heat. Running at 4ohms, the amp will run cooler, and behave better in enclosed spaces. (less/no overheating, longer life...) If your amp is 2ohm stable, you can experiment later with a 2ohm load. Almost all amps that are rated at 4ohms, and are stable at 2ohms; will increase the rated power. There is no real rule of thumb, but you can sometimes see gains from 200w at 4ohms up to 350 to 400w at 2ohms. Please note that quite a few of these will not run 2ohms mono BRIDGED, which is what was described earlier as connecting both subs to the same contacts. Most times +L and -R. Some are different. Had one that was +L and +R. Anyway, They will overheat. It will work (I did it), but the amp will run very hot and will shut down from heat protection unless a fan is on it and the area is very very ventilated. (I ended up cooking my old Kenwood :( ) It was simpler for us way back in the early 90s when it was switched manually between MONO, STEREO 4OHM, STEREO 2OHM.

Two things are what you should worry about. The airspace and the RMS power. Make sure that whatever sub(s) you get will work in the airspace of the box you purchase. Once you have found the right sub/box match, match the amp to the sub combo, with a lowpass corssover ON and the amp in MONO mode. It will work just fine with the subs each on thier own outlet. Keep it simple. smile.gif

BTW... look for a sub with a higher SPL rating. A sub rated at say, 97db (1w @1m) is more efficient than a sub rated at 89 or 91db (1w @ 1m) Just make sure that the test is "1 Watt @ 1 Meter". Don't ask what it means. Just make sure that is what you read on the rating. It should say. A higher SPL means the sub will be "louder" or more sensitive at lower volume levels. smile.gif

[i3eal2sfan]

k thanks man, u cleared that up a lot. ill go over to best buy or circuit city tomorrow or somethin and find out which subs sound the best then prolly but them off of ebay or something. smile.gif

[corndogggy]

Originally posted by b1pig:
Anyway, They will overheat. It will work (I did it), but the amp will run very hot and will shut down from heat protection unless a fan is on it and the area is very very ventilated. (I ended up cooking my old Kenwood...Or maybe that had more to do with the fact that old Kenwood's were not MOSFET. Have it pump alot of current, and it gets hot. When it gets hot, it pumps more current. Which, in turn, makes it hotter. Well guess what, that makes it pump more current. Sooner or later, something's got to give. ;) I never could understand why they did that. Even the Jensen amps from wal-mart were mosfet.

Anyway, I say buy a good amp and bridge it into 4 ohms. That means either buying 1 4 ohm or getting two 8 ohm speakers. Like I said earlier, the amp will actually see two ohms, not 4, which is plenty low. You're going to get more bang for your buck if you bridge it. Just don't push your luck by trying to get your amp to see 1 ohm nominal. Running your amp into 4 ohms stereo is just wasting good power if it's bridgable into 4 ohms.

And yeah I may be confusing people by saying get one 12". I only say that with money in mind. The 12" that I have picked out can be had for like $107 on eBay. For that kind of money, if you're going to get two 10's, they're going to be mediocre at best. Yeah if you compare two 10's to a similar or even slightly better 12, you may get better results, especially in the loudness department. But, for the kind of money we're talking, one high end 12" that's one of the best in the world is going to be lots better than two crapola 10's, but depending on where you go, they may cost about the same. Sure, get some better 10's if you want, but two of them may cost a little more than the price of the 12 I mentioned to get some good 10's. It's quality, not quantity man. smile.gif

[i3eal2sfan]

ok but which box would i need to fit a 12 in the back? and wouldnt it be 2 tight for a 12 to sound good?

[i3eal2sfan]

ok what do u guys think about this idea since i dont have a job right now but i really want subs. in like 2 weeks i will have a job but i cant wait that long. what if i buy good subs like 2 10's and then i buy a real crap amp like pyramid or something, and then it should last until i get my job and can buy a better amp. or the other way, i buy real crap subs but a real good amp and then just replace the subs when i get a better job. what do u think about that idea, keep in mind that im messed up and might blow my brains out if i dont get subs soon :eek: haha ;)

[corndogggy]

Personally I think you know you'd be throwing money away, which goes against your plan of doing something within a budget.

If you absolutely have to do something right now, get the subs you want, and maybe some power wire, and RCA plugs, but don't get your amp. That way you can build your box and make it nice. By the time you figure that out, you get to run all your wires. Once you've done all that, you'll have your job and can get a nice amp soon, and as soon as you get it, it will be ready to be slapped in.

If you want to build your own box but don't have certain tools, keep in mind that alot of hardware stores like Lowe's will cut pretty much anything you want for $0.25 per cut. I can help you out on the dimensions of the cuts if needed.

Back to the box issue, I mean, if the recommended enclosure size for a 10 is .75 cubic feet, and you're going to get two, which would mean 1.5 cubic feet, as compared to a 12 that is recommended for 1.0 cubic foot... you can't really say that it's better for 10's because there's not enough box space for that 12. The only thing I'd be concerned about is the depth. That 12 has a mounting depth of almost 7". I'm not sure how much room you have, but the volume itself is not going to be a problem at all.

[i3eal2sfan]

i think im just gonna go with 2 10's and get the custom downfiring wrangler box. wuts with these pyramid amps? they r cheap and pump out alot of watts but there is no rms for them http://www.pyramidcaraudio.com/itempage.asp?model=PB1281X y dont they say the rms? people say they suck but i heard one of them hooked up to 2 crap 10" audiobahns and it was hitten pretty hard. if i get that then will it break after a couple of months or what?

[corndogggy]

Pyramid does that so they look awesome to uneducated buyers. They are cheap amps that can only do that kind of power for the smallest amount of time imaginable in the most perfect of conditions. Did you find a killer deal on one or something?

[i3eal2sfan]

ya a 2 channel 1600 watt one for like 80 bucks new in the box. i think i just might get that and some decent 10's cause my friends audiobahns suck, he got the 1600 watt pyramid amp and the 2 subs and the box for 100 used and it sounded pretty good actually. it was in a mustang so it was in the trunk and i could still hear it and mine would have nothen blocken it from getten to me because its open ya know wut i mean. so u think i should just get the amp and i know it will crap out eventually but should last a while right.

[muddenjeep]

i have a Infinity basslink in my jeep. it comes with a built in amp and sound great easy to install and it sound better then the 2 mtxs 10 that got stolen + it bolts on the body. heres a link http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3069591921&category=32822

[corndogggy]

Well not to confuse you anymore with things like the quarter wavelength rule, but that's not really how it works. The same setup is not going to be louder in your jeep just because there's nothing between you and the subs. His subs would be further away, he's got the trunk, he's probably got a hardtop, etc. To explain this in a simpler way... consider the two loudest trucks I have ever heard.

First one, it's a Mitsubishi truck with an extended cab and topper. He cuts out the back window and front of the bed to accommodate EIGHT 15's within a foot or so behind the seats. He's running an obnoxious amount of power. One thump can throw a coffee cup off his roof. The decals on his windshield looks like a sub itself, flexing about an inch every time it hits. He hits 153 dB, which is incredible even today, but just jaw dropping nearly 10 years ago.

Second truck, it's a Chevy 1/2 ton truck with a hard bed cover. Extremely simple setup - only one 15", powered by a Punch 150. That Mitsubishi should kill this truck, right? Sorry, this one hits 153 dB too. His sub was in the bed, pointed towards the tailgate, then he had a hole cut through the front of his bed into the cab.

Anyway, yeah it's all in your environment and what you do with what you have.

Do what you want to with that Pyramid, but there's a brand new Rockford Punch 301 amp that does 300 watts rms bridged into 4 ohms for $95 on eBay. That's more than enough for two 10's in the range that you're talking about, and I seriously doubt that the Pyramid you're looking at will do that much. Just keep in mind that the 1600 Watt label on that Pyramid doesn't mean jack.

[b1pig]

ALL INFORMATION IS SUBJECT TO CHANGE AT ANY TIME WITHOUT NOTICE. WE WILL NOT BE HELD RESPONSIBLE FOR MISLEADING INFORMATION. WE ARE CONSTANTLY TRYING TO IMPROVE THE INFORMATION ON OUR WEBSITE, FOR MORE COMPLETE INFORMATION PLEASE EMAIL SUPPORT@pyramidcaraudio.COM I can't say that I beleive the claim of 800w at .04% THD. The rule for amps is $1 per watt. That is typical for high quality amps. If you want to get a Pyramid, go ahead. Corndoggy does make some good references for high quatily pieces and makes a decent argument. BTW, most Rockford Fosgate and MTX amps tend to produce more power than they are rated for. If you dont care what others think, get the Pyramid. If you like to brag to your buddies on what you get... buy something else. :D Thier quality over the years has left much to be desired. Thier info printed on the site does nothing to impress me. I expect to see something like 400w RMS into 4 ohms @ .04%THD, 96db S/N.

A bit of an explanation... S/N is Signal to Noise ratio. Know you math? .5% is worse than .04%, and .08% is better than that. The lower the number, the cleaner the power. If the amp puts out 800 watts, I want to know what the THD is at the power level. You should go to Wal-Mart or a stereo shop. Seriously, go get some literature. You don't have to pay for it! Learn the info!

Oh, and about the Kenwood.... it was a MOSFET amp. smile.gif I also know the rule of Resistance. ;) This could get really deep. You know? 2 10s, DVC, 4ohms per coil. Ser. or parr.? sealed or ported? One 12" sVC or DVC? sealed or ported? Ser. or Parr.?

JL Audio makes subs with a 6ohm resistance, making them much more flexible in mulitple sub applications. smile.gif

Have fun! smile.gif

[corndogggy]

Yeah there's a nearly infinite way of doing whatever. If you want to do your best ricer imitation and just be as loud as possible, I would get two of the highest efficiency 12's I could afford and put them in a small ported box that's tuned to a reliatively high frequency, maybe 60 Hz. I think it will fit, but if not, get two 10's. I would just do something much different if you're looking for sound quality and superior low end response. It's all in what you're looking for and how much you can spend to do it.

Also, as far as getting one item that's high quality and scrimping on something else, I don't recommend that, but if you're going to do that, I'd do it backwards as to what you're planning to do. Don't get great subs and a crapola amp. Clipping is worse for subs than overpowering them. Get a great amp and mediocre subs if you're going to do something like that.

As for the JL 6 ohm subs, I don't know about anymore, but yeah they were introduced as a way to wire up 3 subs and still have a 4 ohm load. They had dual voice coils that were 6 ohms each. You were supposed to wire each sub's two coils in series, making 12 ohms each, then wire each sub up to each other in parallel, making a 4 ohm nominal load. Otherwise, wiring up 3 8 ohm subs would be like 2.7 ohms I think, and there was only one amp on the market back then that was stable that low. Something different at least.

[i3eal2sfan]

i was wonderen if these are any good http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3069238230&category=32823 and if they would fit behind the back seat in a 97. THanks

[corndogggy]

No, they're not really good. Whether or not it would fit obviously depends on that boxes dimensions, but it looks pretty square to me, and the top of that box is looking pretty long. 12's in a sealed box should have a better frequency response than 35 hz. Bass doesn't really get fun until it hits 40 hz in my opinion. Your soft top will be limiting your low range too unfortunately.

[ZUPERODE]

Originally posted by i3eal2sfan:
so should i get 2 10's or 1 12 :confused: go 2 10s if you are going to be with the top off. the sound place that setup my bass system stated that 2 10s would sound better/louder than 1 12.
now about the rms and max wattage..get and amp that at least the rms of the amp is equivalent to the rms of the speakers, that way u can guarantee the speakers will be getting the wattage they need to sound clean and good. remember max wattage is an amount produce at One Time it does not mean it will always hit the high up..
about 1 channel or 2..i got a 1 mono channel fosgate 200 power punch series amp wired at 2 ohms for a 1 10" planet audio. it kicks ass.
per eveywhere i've read, the lower the ohms the better the subs should sound..now in your case. if you have 2 10s that are 4 ohms, and a mono amp that works at 2 ohms..wire the subs this way: take the 2 positives of the subs and connect to the positive in the amp, and then the negative of the subs into the negative of the amp, that should lower your 4 ohms to 2 ohms.
now if you have 2 channel amp, make sure what amount of wattage it pushes Per Channel..some say like 500 1 channel(mono/bridged) 250x2. in this case i would bridge the speakers that way to reduce the ohms and push the 500 into both speakers.
hope that helps.

[ZUPERODE]

Originally posted by corndogggy:
No, they're not really good. Whether or not it would fit obviously depends on that boxes dimensions, but it looks pretty square to me, and the top of that box is looking pretty long. 12's in a sealed box should have a better frequency response than 35 hz. Bass doesn't really get fun until it hits 40 hz in my opinion. Your soft top will be limiting your low range too unfortunately. yeah with the soft top you will certainly not get the full benefits of low bass as with a hard top. been there done that.
good luck

[corndogggy]

Some of you guys are still missing the point when I recommended one 12". It was all about MONEY. If you only had $120 to spend on subs, would it not make alot more sense to buy one speaker that's one of the best available, vs. two mediocre $50 or $60 subs? Those subs I found retails for like $300 each. I just happened to see some crazy deals on them on eBay. Maybe there's other deals on some awesome 10's that you could get for like $50, I'm not sure. Anyway, I mean, crap, just look at the specs. Forget 10's, I could have one 12" Infinity Perfect sounding better than those two MTX 12's listed earlier.

And no, lower ohms doesn't equal better sound. Lower resistance means that your amp can pump out more juice. It also means potentially more heat and more distortion and probably more money when you start doing things like bridging an amp into 2 ohms. Even Rockford says to only bridge them into 4 ohms. Everything has to be matched and well designed.

[Jeep_X03]

Originally posted by corndogggy:
Some of you guys are still missing the point when I recommended one 12". It was all about MONEY. If you only had $120 to spend on subs, would it not make alot more sense to buy one speaker that's one of the best available, vs. two mediocre $50 or $60 subs? Those subs I found retails for like $300 each. I just happened to see some crazy deals on them on eBay. Maybe there's other deals on some awesome 10's that you could get for like $50, I'm not sure. Anyway, I mean, crap, just look at the specs. Forget 10's, I could have one 12" Infinity Perfect sounding better than those two MTX 12's listed earlier.

And no, lower ohms doesn't equal better sound. Lower resistance means that your amp can pump out more juice. It also means potentially more heat and more distortion and probably more money when you start doing things like bridging an amp into 2 ohms. Even Rockford says to only bridge them into 4 ohms. Everything has to be matched and well designed. damn, u are good haha smile.gif

[corndogggy]

Maybe I should put this bad boy in my Grand:

http://www.speakersound.com/index.html?loadfile=itemmtxrfl152.html

Or perhaps somebody wants to tell me that I couldn't get it louder than two junk 12's? :D

[michaelturtle1]

I just picked up an 8" plus amp in a sealed box by clarion that fits in the stock console for $150.00. Fits just like the 6.5" stock sub and it is a plug in type of set up with a harnes syou can get. It is not a pair of ten's or 12's but certainly added that something to my audio that I didn't have before plus I don't have to worry about working around a box or an amp in the small space in a TJ.

[i3eal2sfan]

alright i finnally got a job so money isnt a problem anymore. I think im gonna get 2 10" alpine type R or 1 12". Once again I dont know much and need some help picking out a box and amp to go along with it. If i get 2 10's then i will prolly get the custom wrangler box but can someone show me a specific box that would be able to fit a 12" and still sound good. Also what amp would be good to power 2 10's or 1 12" ? Im thinken MTX Thunder902 i think its called. im not sure of the rms and stuff but the guys at circuit city said its enough to power 2 12's but i dunno how reliable they r... but also you know how you can play different subs with different amps at the store, a little mtx mono amp with only like 200 rms@2 ohms sounden a lot better than an mtx with like 400 watts rms. whats up with that? sorry for asking and reasking every question but now for sure im getting subs. thanks

[corndogggy]

Spend like $30 at the hardware store and build your own.

[i3eal2sfan]

id do that but im not crafty or anything :(

[hockeymutt]

i'm assuming your still in high school...if you have wood shop pay a kid in thier to do they usually have partical board....or at least my school does...and you can get all the measurments and then they have programs on downlaod.com...that will calculate a box size that will fit and sound good....when i got my subs didn't have to worry about the box came with a bandbass box that takes up half the back...so i guess i won't have a backseat

[Jhonyquest97]

damn you guys are confusing the kid. A 1200 WATT pyramid amp puts out 300watts rms bridged at 4 ohms.
I used it untill my Kicker amp came in. Don't worry about it so much if your not going to pull your back seat cause it don't matter. Like someone said b4.. buy subs... then buy an amp that produces the same RMS that the subs require. Nice and easy. If you want more difficult then you can see my setup lol... minus the kicker cause i'm lazy to update. My Setup (http://www.cardomain.com/memberpage/261769)

[i3eal2sfan]

alright i think im gonna do that then. off of ebay you can get a 1600 watt pyramid amp for like 100 bucks and a custom wrangler box for 2 tens for like less than 100 then at circuit city i can get 2 10" alpine for 90 each, get the 2 year warranty on them and get it all installed there. and if it is bad for subs to be underpowerd then ill just underpower them until i get the big amp and then i can always hook up my friends big ass amp and blow the **** outta them and get free subs by warranty smile.gif

[corndogggy]

Or you could just buy this guy's crap and be done with it. You'd save $150, a bunch of sleepless nights, and a helluvalot of confusion.


http://www.jeepsunlimited.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=483910

[i3eal2sfan]

hmmmm, im thinken about buyen that. do you think I should or will i just be blowen my money?

[myfirstYJ]

i was jsut reading all your post and talkin about only havin enough room for one 12 sub in the back well i made a down firing box that has just enough air space sealed for two 12's. it fits real tight but it fits and damn it hits harder then most lowered trucks around here. so check your mesurments cause if i can do it then you guys should be able to lol.

[corndogggy]

Amen. There's plenty of room.

[Jeep_X03]

Originally posted by corndogggy:
Amen. There's plenty of room. there is??, geez i cant find a frickin box for 2 12's anywhere that would fit in a wrangler, damn i must just suck badly at lookin haha!

[i3eal2sfan]

would 2 10" w0 sound any good?

[myfirstYJ]

yea i never seen any box for two 12's that would fit in a jeep i made mine it's sweet too. lol

[TJ_in_TX]

corndoggy - all good advice. You're real smart about this stuff. I agree to cry once, pay the $ and buy good equipment. I put a good single 12 and a good amp, built a tight box into a Tuffy rear storage box,about 1.2 cu ft for woofer, other half for amp and storage. Yes, it's a sheet metal box - that was a bit of a challenge acoustically (perforated metal face, welding, painting) but security was 1st priority. Plenty for Jeep, no competitor, but nice with quality speakers in sound bar & dash and CD changer stuffed into the console (cd's would always skip in the head unit - never in the console). Hits pretty hard when it needs to, and plenty clean. And secure. Get a plan up front about your sound system, build it right, and you're not replacing stuff all the time (unless you want to).

[corndogggy]

Well, let me explain/rephrase my above "amen". First of all, yes there is more than enough room for one 12". I've always said that. Secondly, there is enough room for two twelve's firing forward IF some of these modern high Q sub's recommended air space already accounts for the size of the driver itself. I haven't measured in like a year, but just from the approximate measurements that I remember, you can squeeze out well over 1 cubic foot per sub. Now if you get into a situation where you have to subtract the driver size from that space, then yeah it will be cramped. they will physically fit, but the box will be tuned pretty high. Also, if you made a down firing box, that will cramp it even more. Most down firing boxes have 3-4 inches of clearance. However, even if you make a tiny amount of clearance and you lose say 2"... assuming your inside measurements of the bottom of your box is 12" deep and 36" wide, you're losing 864 cubic inches, or 0.5 cubic feet which is pretty significant if you're already that cramped. Also, alot of cheaper 12's can't handle this size of box, so you would have to get some nicer ones.

[myfirstYJ]

ok since we decided what size subs can fit. What are your opinion on types of boxes downfiring or regular with subs facing forward?? from what i hear on downfiring is u will get more bass cause it has the whole floor to bounce off of specially when the top is down but thats only what i heard.

[corndogggy]

Not sure... I haven't been able to compare them in a jeep. Theoretically, in my opinion, if at all possible you want them to face down in a jeep. This is mainly because of the quarter wavelength rule. Subs can actually be quieter if you are closer to them because of this. This is the same reason that subs in hatchbacks are actually louder if you turn them around backwards or point them straight up as opposed to facing them forward directly through the back seat. This is also why often the loudest place in a car is under the dash. The local shop here in town recommends pointing them down or else the subs will waste all their energy flapping the soft top up and down instead of making usable sound. So with that in mind and not considering box space, I believe the perfect box in a jeep would be a fourth order bandpass box with a rectangular port firing into the open gap between the back of the rear seat and it's bottom. Those take up lots of room though and you'd have to mount the subs vertical which really doesn't have enough room, so downfiring would probably be the next best thing. I'm just saying that if you do that, yeah 12's would be extremely cramped for some air, although it would be really loud in the 70-100 Hz range.

[i3eal2sfan]

what do you think would sound better? 2 10" alpine type R's or 2 10" JBL w0's? OR 1 12" alpine type R or 1 10" JBL w0? sry for so many questions but i dont wanna buy the wrong thing. thanks

[corndogggy]

Maybe you should compromise and get two 11's. :rolleyes:

And there is no "wrong" thing. Remember that I was winning competitions and beating professionals with two Rockford Series 1 12's, which was their very bottom line paper coned speakers. I just wasn't necessarily the loudest by any means, although I could still hit 137 dB with only a Punch 40 and the subs in an isobarik configuration. Just get the best crap that you can afford and be done with it or else we'll still be talking about this next year.

[Jeep_X03]

Originally posted by corndogggy:
Maybe you should compromise and get two 11's. :rolleyes:

And there is no "wrong" thing. Remember that I was winning competitions and beating professionals with two Rockford Series 1 12's, which was their very bottom line paper coned speakers. I just wasn't necessarily the loudest by any means, although I could still hit 137 dB with only a Punch 40 and the subs in an isobarik configuration. Just get the best crap that you can afford and be done with it or else we'll still be talking about this next year. '
mhm i agree and obviously 1 10 wouldnt sound better then 2 10's or 1 12 lol

[McFly]

One 12 will give you deeper tones, and will be more cost effective as far as power/wattage.

Two 10" will be much louder (which is good with a soft top), but won't give you as deep frequencies, and will require generally more power.

I'd suggest ONE good 12" subwoofer.
JL Audio makes incredible sounding (SPL & SQ) subwoofers. Here's my suggestion for an awesome sounding system under $600:

JL Audio 12W3v2 12" sub - $199 (+ free S&H @ onlinecarstereo.com)
Audiobahn 8000T Intake Series amp - $259 (+ free S&H @ onlinecarstereo.com)

That's $460 shipped for a great sub/amp combo that will be SO deep & loud you'll love it - add another $70 for a box and $70 for GOOD cables/fuses/installation accessories and you've got a sick system for $600.

For $300? I'd get:
Sony XM-D400P5 amp for $129 shipped (same website) 200W RMS x 1 @ 4ohms
Alpine SWS-1241 sub for $89 shipped (same site) it's 200W RMS 4-ohm
then you can spend $50 on a sub box built to size by a local car audio guru, and $30 worth of amp installation wires.

Just my .02